4.13 Driven Home 25

March 29th, 2013, 12:01 am

Author Comments:

Gibson Twist, March 28th, 2013, 3:36 pm


THE END!

(Not really)

User Comments:

The_Hankerchief, March 29th, 2013, 12:12 am


Hey now, April Fool's isn't for another few days! haha

Maritza (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 12:13 am


Lauren shouldn't have hit Sam. But yeah, she has all the right in the world to be pissed. Not only at Sam, also her idiotic friends, who think Rick must not be allowed to talk to her or else he'll find a way to worm himself into her pants or something.

Such little RESPECT.

TCGC (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 12:15 am


Ugh. I'd call her a bitch, but then that'd make me anti-woman or whatever.

GorekoTheUnholy, March 29th, 2013, 12:19 am


Well shit hit the fan is now running down the walls I guess

mirandamarquez, March 29th, 2013, 12:26 am


Maybe an alien abduction wouldn't go amiss here.

With probes.

For the benefit of the congenitally humourless amongst us:

3rd Panel, Pub sign, angle, above Rick and Lauren looks a lot like a flying saucer to me.

Teenlink, March 29th, 2013, 12:37 am


I'm gonna laugh so hard if Rick gets her home and tries to sleep with her, totally proving Sam's jealousy well earned. Later, Lauren will write a letter to a winged unicorn about the lessons of friendship that she learned, and the relationship between friendship and magic. But that doesn't seem to fit Twist's style, so we'll see.

skwidmonster (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 12:41 am


And then they got married.

Seth (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 12:54 am


@Teenlink: Nah, not going to happen. Rick's smart enough to be more concerned with covering his conniving ass at the moment.

Skylan2021 (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 1:28 am


Like shes any better -.-

Sandra (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 4:58 am


I'm with Lauren. How dare her boyfriend try to tell her who she can and cannot be friends with. Oh what, he feels slighted by Rick, so he hits him? I wonder how Rick feels about this, he only gets to see the asshole side of the friends of Lauren, no wonder he thinks she can do better. Perhaps she can if they act like that...

That guy (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 5:59 am


In Sam's defense, the very first time he met Rick, he didn't act like an asshole. He tried to engage him and be civil and friendly, and Rick just completely brushed him off and ignored him to exclusively focus on Lauren and act like Sam wasn't even there. Any time after that is when Sam started being leery of Rick. Had Rick been considerate and responsive when they first met, Sam probably wouldn't have such a bad first impression of him and things probably wouldn't have gotten this bad. All the scummy stuff Rick's done since then isn't helping his case.

Quadrant, March 29th, 2013, 6:13 am


Considering Sam still doesn't trust Rick, who seems to have played this right into his hand, I wouldn't be surprised if Sam and Cristo are up for some stealthy following.

ParadoxDeity, March 29th, 2013, 7:55 am

Hrmmm
Why do I smell a daterape or other kind of fucked-up situation coming along at the hands of Rick?

ParadoxDeity, March 29th, 2013, 7:57 am


@Maritza: It's not just a matter of that, though. I am more pissed off at Rick for his lack of respect towards the others - who see through his little game - than I am at the others being disrespectful of Lauren. If you recall, this subject of Rick has been broached several times, and Lauren refuses to hear anything about him at all. Honestly, at this point, if something bad happens to her, she's got no one to blame for it but herself.

Laemmchnexxl (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 8:02 am


Sandra, was the punch about their friendship?

No, it was the disrespect.

Read yesterdays post from Whulfdan (start bottom end). Humans are violent animals, and everyone has his triggers.

My wife once had to "kill" someone. The someone was not there, so she took a broomstick, hitted it until completely exhausted and no, the broomstick didnt survive. After that she felt better.
And i know no one with less violence than her, knowing a lot of people. But everyone has his triggers!

Headbiter (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 8:32 am


No Sam, you didn't. The writer just wants to shoehorn this message into the audience's heads.

But I just realized where I experienced this kind of frustrating device before: This story-arc is the Book of Truth from Ultima IX. You know, the one that asks you wether you are responsible for the evil on Britannia and you are not allowed to continue with the story unless you admit it? Pretty much that.

Amgodtic (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 8:40 am


...ya did OK, Sam. Ya did OK.

The game's not over, but the ball's in Rick's court. If he's too forward, he'll scare her off, but if he toes the line, he could break them up tonight.

I've been focusing on Sam's part in this, what he should do, and not saying anything about Lauren's actions; but I understand what Sam and Rick are doing and thinking. I can't understand Lauren, because I can't imagine being in her position and NOT seeing what Rick's doing. So I can't get inside her head.

Jeffko, March 29th, 2013, 9:20 am


So Lauren gets to slap Sam with apparently zero regrets on her part over the fact that Sam punched Rick, after which he felt incredibly remorseful? Is that how it works? Shame on him for resorting to physical violence! Let's teach him a lesson with MORE physical violence. I mean it's just a slap, right? He had it coming, right?

Christ...

I honestly can't wait to see the reaction from the rest of the group, but especially Michelle, Melanie and Kara.

Tarabba, March 29th, 2013, 9:50 am


@Jeffko: Yes, all of this, YES! My thoughts exactly. Hoping Michelle will be the one to tell Lauren that what she did is no better than what Sam did. Hoping.

Simon (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 10:07 am


Oh! Date rape, alien probes (rape), maybe Lauren should get ran over by a bus after Rick rapes her, maybe she should die or just be horribly disfigured! Hey, maybe Rick is a serial killer who will torture her for weeks, yeah! YEAH!

Maybe we should just burn her at the stake like the wicked woman she is, because God knows no horror is too much for a woman who dares to commit the ultimate crime: not being likable.

Everyone wishing such on her is sick. (Ps, also not right to wish Mulligan be beat for a word, no matter how horrible. But the majority of the sick wishes are directed to, surprise, a woman.)

Truly sorry if this harshness upsets anyone who's a survivor, but fuck, people, wake the fuck up and be better. You're being the basest part of humanity: you're being the problem.

Guest, March 29th, 2013, 11:23 am


@Chris P: He probably feels awkward as hell, as anyone who's friends with one person in a friend group does when shit goes down. Still not convinced of Rick being an evil mastermind. hahaha, not everyone is <3 Alexander <3 , which everyone thought was awesome until he wasn't.

Simon (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 11:28 am


Sorry about the double post! I can't delete it. Sorry, should sign up maybe.

@Headbiter: if you think someone feeling sorry for their actions (which brought about badness all-around) is unrealistic, your world is a sad one indeed! He did fuck up!

Gibson Twist, March 29th, 2013, 11:35 am


@Simon: I deleted it for you. Cheers.

Corbeau (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 12:30 pm

Rick the Evil
@ParadoxDeity: I feel sort of the same: I think something is not okay with Rick. He doesn't seem to have any friends and the way he always pops up wherever Lauren is with some lame excuse, it is kinda creepy. I don't like at all, how he can't just say: I came here because you do, and you're my friend. What he does is not honest, and if he lies in such a small thing how am I supposed to know that he won't in more important matters?
Not that I want anything that bad happen to Lauren (or anyone else actually). A little disappointment in blond prince serves her right, but a date rape - no!

Sandra (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 1:43 pm


Really? Sam was civil when he first met him? So you are used to being asked if you live in Dildo? Even if Sam meant that civilly, you have to remember that Rick was already weary of Laurens friends because of the way Christo behaved. It must've not given him a good first impression and might make him stand- offish to the rest. And everything after that just told him he was right in his assumption that Laurens friends were not to be trusted. A little Pride and prejudiced right there. So why should he talk to Sam when he thinks he will get nasty remarks about where he comes from?

Then again, I might be off and Rick is this one dimensional character who is only after Lauren because she is hot, and he will prove Christo that he is a asshole who will now rape her because she is "vulnerable". But I really don't think so. Collage can be a lonely place and finding someone who you can talk with about the subjects you like to talk about can be hard. Maybe he is a loner and really likes Lauren for a friend.

Why doesn't Rick talk to Sam? Why doesn't Sam just talk to Rick? Who knows, but my guess is that the cat is coming out the bag soon now. Or there is going to be yet another twist. That would seem even more likely, knowing mr. Twist.

Rhem (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 2:03 pm


I love virtually everything else that he does, but I really dislike and disagree with Twist's approach to violence and its consequences. Two major times now in the comic we've seen violence: the first, Peter, and now Sam. Peter's wasn't as bad as this is. Yeah, he got all emo and melodramatic, but that is clearly intended to be a part of his character. This whole looking back thing has shown that off at every opportunity. Do I think Twist went 500% overboard? Yes. But was the concept, at least, within reason? Also yes. I also think that if he was going to portray Lauren this way, he really should have changed Mel slightly to give her a noticeable case of Stockholm, which wouldn't have been unreasonable in any case. Essentially, he is making Lauren into an RNG with every "progressive" trait in the book to draw from, which means I won't be commenting after this for a while because the whole "progressive" social movement bores me. We've reached the end of that goal, folks. Time to move on and smell the coffee of the 21st century.

Maritza (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 4:01 pm


"Honestly, at this point, if something bad happens to her, she's got no one to blame for it but herself."

:raises eyebrow:

Maritza (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 4:15 pm


Also God forbid a woman for wanting to be friends with someone her boyfriend/friends don't approve.

She deserves ANYTHING AFTER THAT.

Headbiter (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 4:22 pm


@Simon: I think you missed my point. Badly.

That aside: "my world", oh thee woeful poet, is not sad. It's just a bit bigger than yours I presume.

Tarabba, March 29th, 2013, 5:25 pm


Anyone wishing ill on Lauren because they think she "deserves" it: just... stop.

I don't agree with how Lauren is handling the situation (or anyone for that matter) but big whoop, maybe she messed up, but they ALL DID. ALL three of them. Everyone is making their own mistakes, but saying someone deserves to beaten or raped is asinine. Period.

Photocopier (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 6:42 pm


I'm enjoying this story arch as much as the rest of the comic, Mr Twist is a master yarn spinner, but I've noticed the comments section feels a lot more hostile lately. I think we all need a good one inch punch gig to lift our spirits. Hopefully recent events aren't going to interfere with the last show of their tour.

comicgirl, March 29th, 2013, 6:55 pm


@Sandra: That was after the initial brush off. When they first met and spoke, he was all polite and stuff. Rick barely said two words to Sam and then started up a conversation with Lauren. Sam tried to get Rick to converse with him still for a bit. And then when it was forthcoming that the only thing he'd be getting was one word-monotone-dismissive answers, that's when he started being an asshole.

Hell, before that, Sam was sure that Christo was overreacting. Completely. It wasn't until he dealt with Rick himself that he got the picture.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
All this being said, I dislike Lauren. I dislike her a lot. My opinion? She's a terrible girlfriend. Terrible. I'm not saying Sam didn't fuck up. Truth of the matter is, as far as his girlfriend is concerned, he did so that's fact. His relationship is now more precarious than ever.

God, I just want them to break up already. That's what Lauren deserves. No real harm or trauma. Just get herself proven wrong so that she has to end the friendship with Rick, go apologize to Sam and oops... he's not there to return to.

Guest, March 29th, 2013, 7:04 pm


@Maritza: HAHAHA, oh Maritza, ya that's totally what everyone is pissed about.

Andy (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 9:14 pm


@Maritza: Which friends would those be? The make friends who only found out about the situation after the first punch flew, or the female friends who've been on Lauren's side the entire time?

There's definitely a distinct lack of respect right now, but it's coming more from Rick and Lauren than from Sam. Yes, Sam doesn't respect Lauren enough to fully trust her, and to think that Rick's play would work. But Lauren hasn't shown Sam that his trust would be well-placed. She doesn't respect Sam enough to actually step back and wonder if he has a point. She may still with him after, but she hasn't really given him a chance to talk anything through. She just runs roughshod over any complaints he's had. That's not something you do to someone you respect, especially if they're a significant other. I would suspect Lauren's disrespect bothers Sam more than Rick's. As for Rick, he clearly doesn't respect Sam's position as Lauren's chosen significant other, and he's not respecting their relationship at all. And a logical followup to that would be that he doesn't respect Lauren. He thinks so little of her that he thinks if she shows up and is friendly, flirts a little, nudges a little, he can take her away from someone she loves. If you're going to say that Sam doesn't respect Lauren because he believes Rick's play will work, you have to say that Rick disrespects Lauren for the exact same reason.

And, interestingly enough, Rick's play IS working.

Which brings me to what's pissing me off most about this storyline. Lauren's going home with a man other than her significant other, a man that (if I remember correctly) she has admitted may well have romantic feelings and/or lust for her. And then she has the gall to tell Sam off for asking if she's doing so. Let me repeat that. She thinks Sam, the man she claims to love, and with whom she lives, is out of line because he's asking if she's going to go home with another man. That, right there, is where she leaves the line in the dust. Up to this point, she was toeing the line, maybe stepping over a little. Everything she had done so far could be forgiven, if not entirely easily. But now she's literally leaving her significant other and going with another man, and that's something that would be damn hard for just about anyone to forgive.

So, did Sam fuck up? Oh hell yes. But no worse than anyone else in this scenario. He's just the only one willing to admit it so far.

Andy (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 9:18 pm


You know who I blame for this whole mess? Peter.

And before you grab the torches and pitchforks, let me explain. Just a few strips ago, he asked why a guy can't be friends with a girl he likes without trying to steal her from her boyfriend. And everyone kinda chuckled, because we all knew that's what he'd done with Lauren.

But therein lies the problem. Lauren isn't expecting guys to try to break her and Sam up because the only guy who had a thing for her while she was taken never acted on it. Peter broke Lauren's innate bullshit meter and early warning systems. Clearly, he is to blame.

(Note: this comment was meant in jest. I really would appreciate it if you would leave those implements of destruction where they are, as my hide generally prefers being unperforated. Please.)

Maritza (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 9:53 pm


"@Maritza: Which friends would those be? The make friends who only found out about the situation after the first punch flew, or the female friends who've been on Lauren's side the entire time?"

Why is it that Lauren's female friends side with her if she's a horrible person?

"Yes, Sam doesn't respect Lauren enough to fully trust her, and to think that Rick's play would work. But Lauren hasn't shown Sam that his trust would be well-placed."

No? What has she done to show she's not to be trusted? Has she kissed Rick? Has she flirted with him? Has she let him cope a feel? Hell, have they ever met in a private place, instead of cafeterias and parks? Have they ever held hands, hugged in an intimate way? Anything? Bueller?

"She doesn't respect Sam enough to actually step back and wonder if he has a point."

I guess she hasn't. I guess she should have had 60 conversations about that guy instead of six, so you could consider her actually wondering if he has a point.

"If you're going to say that Sam doesn't respect Lauren because he believes Rick's play will work, you have to say that Rick disrespects Lauren for the exact same reason."

True, but I'm not concerned for Rick. Rick's a douchebag. And Lauren states very clearly to Rick that she loves Sam, that she's committed to him.

"She thinks Sam, the man she claims to love, and with whom she lives, is out of line because he's asking if she's going to go home with another man."

The implication "going home with another man" is that they're going to have sex or be whatsover sexually or romantically involved. She could be going home with Christo and she would be going home with another man. And THAT would not be what Sam is implying. Oh maybe he didn't imply it but that's what it sounded like, and that's why she is extra pissed.

"Everything she had done so far could be forgiven"

Except she has done nothing. If anything, the only bad thing she has done was slapping Sam. That was an amazingly stupid move and out of line. See, she should have listened to Rick there.

Tarabba, March 29th, 2013, 10:36 pm


@Maritza:

"I guess she hasn't. I guess she should have had 60 conversations about that guy instead of six, so you could consider her actually wondering if he has a point."

I just wish one of those conversations was actually with Sam. Communication is lacking all over the place, from all sides. Guess we all just have to wait and see how they get back together (though despite knowing the outcome it somehow doesn't make it less frustrating).

Maritza (Guest), March 29th, 2013, 10:43 pm


One of those conversations was with Sam.

see the archive page pointed as 4-12-six-conversations-about-that-guy-2

Tarabba, March 29th, 2013, 11:08 pm


@Maritza: Ahh!! My bad, don't know why I missed that.

Andy (Guest), March 30th, 2013, 12:03 am


@Maritza: The thing about that conversation is that she immediately dismissed Sam. She didn't consider his argument, or try to provide a counter argument. All she said was, and I quote, "You're imagining it." That's not cool to do to your significant other. I've been on both sides of this one; once I thought someone was getting a little too close to my girlfriend, and once she told me that I was being too friendly with another girl. In both cases, the offending party listened and kept an eye out for trouble. Lauren hasn't done anything like that. She keeps jumping to Rick's defense, or turning the argument into how Sam doesn't trust her. While this is, as I said earlier, a valid point, it also fails to actually address Sam's fears. And it shows how stupid everyone in this situation is being, as none of them are willing to step back and think about it.

Gibson Twist, March 30th, 2013, 12:40 am

Guest, March 30th, 2013, 12:49 am


@Gibson Twist: Fair enough. I retract my complain on that ground.

I still think everyone involved is being an idiot. And, given the tendency of people in general to pick one side or the other, I can't stress that enough. This isn't a situation where one single person is at fault; one person might be more at fault than another, but they're all to blame.

Sam should be more trusting, Lauren should be more reassuring, and Rick should be keeping his nose out of their relationships.

DemonicMRX11 (Guest), March 30th, 2013, 2:45 am


Hey @Gibson Twist, any chance the next character that isn't "part of the group"'s run doesn't end after some conflict? It might be nice change-up to have some extra just move away or slowly grow apart, lol! Although, maybe we're totally being misled about Rick and he'll go out that way, in which case I'd have to say: You Sly Dog, You ;)

Gibson Twist, March 30th, 2013, 8:07 am


@DemonicMRX11: I don't agree with the premise that non-group characters don't drift away. You may not notice when it happens because they don't go out with a flourish.

Guest, March 30th, 2013, 8:53 am


buh-bye lauren.....dont let the door hit you.

Proving Sam's point.

Rhys (Guest), March 30th, 2013, 9:03 am

Lauren and Sam
Knowing that Lauren and Sam end up together again, I look at the situation with dull optimism. I hope Sam gets back the girl he loves, but honestly, being in Sams position in the past, I just think that Lauren has crossed the line too many times and is being both hypocritical and is overreacting to Sam making one mistake.
I'd rather that Lauren is faced with a horrible eye opening experience, so that Sam is meant to be the one who rescues her, but doesn't, and she decides that she does need him.

Quendor (Guest), March 30th, 2013, 9:24 am

Let her go
Just let her go Sam. She isn't worth it.

Tubs (Guest), March 30th, 2013, 10:51 am


Damn, this arc has sparked so much controversy! I think the best thing Sam can do right now is to just let her go and hope she comes back on her own. I really hope Rick isn't some sort of date rapist or abuser ,but I don't trust him. He's shady...and fake. If that Rick does anything though, his head'll be on a platter!

Whulfdan, March 30th, 2013, 1:15 pm


@Laemmchnexxl: *Thank you.*

Whulfdan, March 30th, 2013, 2:05 pm

The whole thing
Mr. Twist - I think you're doing a great job with this story line. I've seen these situations before and who hasn't, especially at that age. IMO you've handled the reality of the way people act very well. We rarely see ourselves as the "bad guy" in a given situation, especially as that situation is ongoing. And you've shown us this in detail.


Rick: The obvious weasel. It's entirely possible he's not what he seems, but we've all had to deal with the kind of guy that he *seems* to be at some time or another. And even if he's the weasel he seems to be, he probably doesn't see anything wrong with wrecking someone else's relationship. After all, if Lauren and Sam were "supposed to be together" then Lauren would've told him piss off by now. Since she hasn't...

Lauren: She doesn't think that she's doing anything wrong. She's told Sam that she isn't into Rick. She's told Rick flat-out that she's with Sam and that she has no intentions of leaving him - even if she hasn't done it in front of Sam. She's told Rick and that should be enough. She's told Rick to cut the trash-talk - even if she hasn't done so in front of Sam. She's told Rick and that should be enough. She (as far as we know) hasn't indulged in *anything* physical with Rick, which is where many people draw that particular line. If it isn't physical, it isn't cheating. And I believe that she honestly sees Sam's behavior as being rooted in *nothing* but jealousy - fear that she'd leave him for Rick.

Sam: Other than throwing the punch, he doesn't think that he's done anything wrong. He's tried to talk to Lauren about his feelings, he's pointed out time and again that his problem is with Rick. And not once (that we've seen) has he tried to "forbid" Lauren from hanging out with Rick. Sam's stated issues have always been with Rick's blatant disrespect. After initially *trying* to treat Rick in a basically respectful and inclusive manner.

No one thinks that they're in the wrong. Even though, to varying degrees, they *all* are.

We all usually are.

Towel (Guest), March 30th, 2013, 2:20 pm


@Maritza: Yeah, I agree. She has every right to be angry. But nobody can ever, ever hit their partner. That is a line that cannot be crossed in a relationship, ever (except in consensual kink play and all of that).

Towel (Guest), March 30th, 2013, 2:21 pm


@TCGC: It just makes you misogynistic, but if you're comfortable with that, hey! Good for you. I bet you feel very proud about your clever use of vocabulary.

Whulfdan, March 30th, 2013, 4:00 pm

Really?
@Towel: Calling someone a bitch makes you a misogynist? Even though - in American English - the word has mostly lost it's original meaning when used as an insult? Even though women refer to women they personally dislike as bitches? Even though members of both sexes refer to *men* they personally dislike as bitches?

Does that make damn-near *everyone* a misogynist? Just wondering about your logic on this one.

Gibson Twist, March 30th, 2013, 6:12 pm


@Whulfdan: To be honest, bitch is a really terrible word in that the way we use it regards men and women as inherently unequal. When a woman is called a bitch, it means, in the best sense, aggressive or dominating, though often it carries negative connotations of those traits. When men are called bitches, it means sniveling, submissive, milquetoast. The result is a connotation that women are (or should be) naturally suborned to men, that women who are assertive are on the same level (same term) as men who are less manly.

The statistics of use in something that is ideologically wrong does not make it right. It's not as much people who are "misogynist" in this sense as our culture is.

The_Hankerchief, March 30th, 2013, 7:37 pm


Kind of a shame Sam got kicked out of the bar, looks like he could use another beer.

Guest, March 30th, 2013, 8:42 pm


Im not sure where all these silly psudo-political statements on the state of men vs women affairs are coming from.


Sometimes calling someone a 'bitch' is just a statement on how big an as*hole they are being.

Its Not a political rant on the submissivemness of women or comparing them to 'less than manly' men.

Its just saying "Hey...dont be a dick".


And yes women can be dicks too.

Gibson Twist, March 30th, 2013, 8:54 pm


@Guest: Then why not call them an asshole? Why not call them a dick? If it's truly the same, why is there a disparity in what the same word means when applied to different genders? Just because you're not sure where it comes from doesn't mean it doesn't come from somewhere.

comicgirl, March 30th, 2013, 9:04 pm


@Simon: You just reposted an earlier comment from yesterday. Just throwing that out there.

Guest, March 30th, 2013, 9:35 pm


@Gibson Twist:
Why not? I dunno...flavor I guess. Variety?

Bitch is a nice word for a asshole lady.
Dick works better for asshole men.

Neither is meant to evoke some pseudo-political statement on the repression of women, but merely to convey the opinion that "Hey...you suck."

Gibson Twist, March 30th, 2013, 10:18 pm


@Guest: If you can't see the inherent bigotry in reserving some insults for women and some for men, I can only surmise that you are trying not to do, but bitch and dick are not lateral terms. Thinking they are lacks a fundamental understanding of one or both. There is no flavour or variety if the word is used in ubiquity and with specific meaning.

Also, I'm not sure you understand the term 'pseudo-political,' because you're not using it correctly. Again, just because it isn't consciously intended by some to mean a thing doesn't mean it doesn't mean that thing. Your lack of understanding on an issue does not negate validity of the issue.

Gibson Twist, March 30th, 2013, 10:30 pm


@comicgirl: This is a system glitch, we're trying to fix it.

Guest, March 31st, 2013, 12:32 am


@Gibson Twist:
I understand what you are trying to say in what you perceive to be race/gender based slanders.

I understand that ones world view might color a certain word or phrase (incorrectly) into a frame that fits said world view, but again...just because some one thinks it is so...does not make it thus.

I have no idea what the above writers are intending with thier use of 'bitch' or otherwise, but I think its a fallicy to imply certain intent without evidence....(or to be more reckless)...imply intent based only on ones own world view.


That said, I must clarify that this is no way should be contrued as a criticism of the storyline...which is, as always, excellent...but rather a precaution against commenters impressing thier own prejudices upon the statements of others.

Gibson Twist, March 31st, 2013, 10:58 am


@Guest: I don't think you do understand what I'm saying. If you use a word to mean a different thing for a woman than it does for a man, that is sexism no matter how desperately you try to cling to the idea that it isn't.

"I understand that ones world view might color a certain word or phrase (incorrectly) into a frame that fits said world view, but again...just because some one thinks it is so...does not make it thus."

Physician, heal thyself.

Simon (Guest), March 31st, 2013, 12:40 pm


Oh! Date rape, alien probes (rape), maybe Lauren should get ran over by a bus after Rick rapes her, maybe she should die or just be horribly disfigured! Hey, maybe Rick is a serial killer who will torture her for weeks, yeah! YEAH!

Maybe we should just burn her at the stake like the wicked woman she is, because God knows no horror is too much for a woman who dares to commit the ultimate crime: not being likable.

Everyone wishing such on her is sick. (Ps, also not right to wish Mulligan be beat for a word, no matter how horrible. But the majority of the sick wishes are directed to, surprise, a woman.)

Truly sorry if this harshness upsets anyone who's a survivor, but fuck, people, wake the fuck up and be better. You're being the basest part of humanity: you're being the problem.

Guest, March 31st, 2013, 5:01 pm


@Gibson Twist:


"Physician, heal thyself."

Hey...uncool bro. Uncool.

Whulfdan, March 31st, 2013, 6:52 pm

Okay
@Gibson Twist: I can see where you're coming from on that. I hadn't looked at the word itself from that particular angle. I don't think that many people do - at least not the folks that I interact with on a daily basis.

But I can definitely see where, from you perspective it would be a much more hurtful term and can respect that.

Thanks for the honest and detailed answer!

TCGC (Guest), March 31st, 2013, 7:00 pm


@Towel: Wow, you saw right through me. That's pretty impressive.

I'd love to stay and argue with you, but I'm off to go rock a 40 oz, beat up some women, and post on some pro-male forum about how the liberal feminazis are oppressing men everywhere.

DemonicMRX11 (Guest), March 31st, 2013, 7:03 pm


@Gibson Twist: I can see your point on that. It might just seem like a character didn't really click with the audience and instead of writing them out with (possibly unnecessary) drama, you just stop altogether and count on the reader to forget about them. Then a bunch could end up like "Hey, whatever happened to so-and-so?" which would probably be annoying after a while. It would be easier just to give them clear closure.

Whulfdan, March 31st, 2013, 7:16 pm

Honest Question
@Gibson Twist: You seem to have an actual background in Gender Politics - College courses maybe? - and I've never made an actual study of it myself. Your discussion with "Guest" sparked my curiosity - would it be considered misogynistic or sexist to call a woman a "dick"?

'Cause if it's not, I have a couple of people I might start using it on!

Gibson Twist, March 31st, 2013, 7:19 pm


@DemonicMRX11: My only answer to that would be, how often in real life have you (anyone) said of someone you used to know, "whatever happened to...?"



@Whulfdan: I don't actually have any kind of formal background, training, or study in Gender Politics, no. It's just something that's been important to me for a long time, not just in gender but in many areas of uneven social standing and treatment.

I'm of a mind, though many disagree with me, that referring to someone by a genital slur isn't in itself sexist. The meaning or intent of the word can be sexist, for sure, but when a term is applied with the same meaning to anyone, to me that is the definition of egalitarian. Personally, I call women dicks all the time. And assholes, cocks, douches, etc. Reserving those words for men is, to me, the sexist act.

Kotire, March 31st, 2013, 7:38 pm

A request if I may...
@Gibson Twist: God Sir Twist, if it is at all possible, I was hoping to get an avatar made of the image of me on - 4.13 DRIVEN HOME 19. I apologize for not sending this request via email.

Whulfdan, March 31st, 2013, 11:29 pm

Hmmm.
@Gibson Twist: Interesting. Thanks for the input.

While I've never had an inclination to study Gender Politics in an academic fashion - not interested in politics in general for various reasons - I've pondered the whole feminist/non-feminist political stances with the "official" definitions and common social contexts and consider myself an *egalitarian*. I consider all humans to be equal at a basic level. There are superior individuals in every club (gender, ethnic group, etc.) and there are inferior *individuals* in *every* club. It's up to the individual human to prove where on the spectrum they land.

DemonicMRX11 (Guest), April 1st, 2013, 12:11 am


@Gibson Twist: I've actually said that a few times... I've had people kinda float in and out of my "universe." A lot of the time it was just hectic schedules and/or time for our paths to fork, I guess. But a few forks have bent back in and out again, etc. a few times. I suppose it's a product of being young in a small enough space that's just big enough to disappear when you want to.

Simon (Guest), April 1st, 2013, 9:09 am


Oh! Date rape, alien probes (rape), maybe Lauren should get ran over by a bus after Rick rapes her, maybe she should die or just be horribly disfigured! Hey, maybe Rick is a serial killer who will torture her for weeks, yeah! YEAH!

Maybe we should just burn her at the stake like the wicked woman she is, because God knows no horror is too much for a woman who dares to commit the ultimate crime: not being likable.

Everyone wishing such on her is sick. (Ps, also not right to wish Mulligan be beat for a word, no matter how horrible. But the majority of the sick wishes are directed to, surprise, a woman.)

Truly sorry if this harshness upsets anyone who's a survivor, but fuck, people, wake the fuck up and be better. You're being the basest part of humanity: you're being the problem.

Simon (Guest), April 1st, 2013, 12:06 pm


@Headbiter: "No Sam, you didn't. The writer just wants to shoehorn this message into the audience's heads."

Sounds pretty explicit to me! And the sign of someone with a very narrow world view if you think this represents an agenda and not a reasonable reaction. Don't know what to say to you, dear person, your words are your own.

Also: So sorry for the extra posts, everyone...No intentional spam was intended.

Guest, April 7th, 2013, 12:46 pm


I hate how a girl hitting a guy seems so normal. Like she has the right, or something. It's violence too.
Same thing with the beer spill on Mulligan.

ParadoxDeity, April 8th, 2013, 8:22 am


@Simon: Yeah, you missed the point of what I was saying, but this isn't really all that big of a surprise, since most people do.

Coming from a home that was best-case described as "broken," a lot of the issues that Gibson touches upon in this comic hit rather close to the heart for me. However, I have always been of the opinion that when anybody - regardless of gender, race, etc - puts themselves into a bad situation and then refuses to get out of it while it gets steadily worse and worse.... well, they have nobody to blame but themselves for it.

I know it's probably hard for you, Gibson, and many others to separate what I've said before and what I'm saying now as not being contradictory, but as a Realist, I understand that there are certain things that, statistically speaking, are pretty much things to happen to women moreso than men (date rape being one of those).

If you take a look at other comments I've made since the one you are somewhat replying to, you'll notice that I've fully admitted (in my own way) that I might have been wrong about Rick.

I'd talk more, but I have to leave for work. Traffic in California is a bitch.

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